Point guard issue

[MicksTheGuy]

So where do we get a point guard at? What we have coming in I am very happy with. If we have an area to address it would be pg. So what players are we looking at and have a real chance to get. Vaughn would make an excellent SG who would give us a 2nd point guard on the floor but is perfect for being the scorer. Would it be best to have someone really quick with all of the height we have coming in and the fact we want to press? Thoughts?

[shaunsimpson]

PG is a big need area and the names that have been thrown around a lot are Dee Bost, Courtney Fortson and Jordan Thoedore. I think that anyone of these three would be great to have, but everyone seems to like a differnet one of these three.

[bengals21]

I think we have the best chance of landing Dee Bost. I think Thoedore is a long shot and Fortson did't list UC in the last update. Don't forget about Chris Wyse. I think it will either be him or Bost.

[waterhead]

We need a 4 star point guard or higher to go with our 4 star center. Getting a 3 star guy isn't going to make much difference. We already have guys that can manage the point as well as a three star guy. That's what will get us back to the promised land. A guy like Downey or Satterfield would come in real handy right about now and I know just the guy who can pull it off.

Mick for President! I hope he can coach as well as he can recruit.

[bearcatd]

We need Devan Downey.

[bengals21]

I doubt Mick pays attention to the number of stars next to a guys name.

[DMoney_70]

Amen on the Downey thing. We could be a little cocky as fans going into this season if Downey had stayed. Water under the bridge though fellas. The sky's the limit for the future.

Go Mick.

[levydl]

We need a 4 star point guard or higher to go with our 4 star center. Getting a 3 star guy isn't going to make much difference. We already have guys that can manage the point as well as a three star guy. That's what will get us back to the promised land. A guy like Downey or Satterfield would come in real handy right about now and I know just the guy who can pull it off.

Mick for President! I hope he can coach as well as he can recruit.

I don't think it matters what star some recruiting guru gives them. Bishop, Davis, and Belton are all 3 star guys (I think). What we need is a PG that Mick likes. I'll go with his assessment every time over scout's or rivals' or whomever's rankings.

I'd much rather have a couple of true PGs than a bunch of guys that can "manage" the point. White, Kirkland, Flint, and Nick Williams are some of the guys in the past that were said to be able to "manage" the point. To me, I'd rather see them playing their natural position and get a solidly if not spectacularly rated PG who will be pretty good as an upperclassman. I thought that is what our difficulties in the tournament taught us, that there is no substitute for true PG play.

Getting a 3 star recruit might not make a difference when he's a freshman, but it will when he gets some experience under his belt.

[waterhead]

I was just using the stars as a barometer of the level of talent without knowing what else to use. If we want to be back in the big time we need a big time point guard. I'm talking about trying to win the Beast conference and getting back to the final four. All these other guys can be 4 and 5 stars but without a great PG to run the show and dish the rock they might as well be 3 star guys. We have had our share of average and below average point guards which is why we have had our share of average and below average NCAA tournament showings.

I agree with you on not wanting to have a non point guard manage the game but to me it doesn't matter if they do or an average point guard does. It gets you to the same place. Average finish. I also agree that Mick will pick a good one whether his current star rating is 2 or 5.

[shaunsimpson]

I also forgot about Kemba Walker who was mentioned a lot a while ago, but I haven't heard much lately.

[NorrisHopper30]

Courtney Fortson or Dee Bost in a few years.

[UCMike]

According to Paul Biancardi on ESPN's insider Wyse is coming to UC. It was up on Lance's blog the other day.

[MikeInClifton]

According to Paul Biancardi on ESPN's insider Wyse is coming to UC. It was up on Lance's blog the other day.

Wyse has to prove himself next season at a prep school, academically and skill wise.

[shaunsimpson]

I don't want to sound harsh, but I Wyse good enough? Maybe it is a grade thing, but he just doesn't seem to have the talent level that the others do. I have not seen him play and couldn't really tell you how good he is even if I did, but I haven't heard much about Wyse outside of him saying he was going to UC.

[waterhead]

So for PG we are looking at:

Theodore
Walker
Bost
Fortson
Wyse

It looks to me by the scouting sites that Theodore is the best of this group. Are Fortson and Bost both moving to 08'? I haven't been able to find much on Wyse. To tell you the truth I wouldn't mind grabbing two PG's since it's tough to tell who will be able to succeed in Big East basketball and who can't handle it. If you can get a 5 star guy you don't have to worry as much but most of these guys, if not all, are 3 stars or less. Yes, I know that stars only mean so much but it's my only way to gauge their potential right now.

Any thoughts on which one of these guys we need and why?

[ME80]

I want a point guard that is a 80%+ free throw shooter

[levydl]

So for PG we are looking at:

Theodore
Walker
Bost
Fortson
Wyse

It looks to me by the scouting sites that Theodore is the best of this group. Are Fortson and Bost both moving to 08'? I haven't been able to find much on Wyse. To tell you the truth I wouldn't mind grabbing two PG's since it's tough to tell who will be able to succeed in Big East basketball and who can't handle it. If you can get a 5 star guy you don't have to worry as much but most of these guys, if not all, are 3 stars or less. Yes, I know that stars only mean so much but it's my only way to gauge their potential right now.

Any thoughts on which one of these guys we need and why?

By this time next year, Theodore and Fortson, and maybe even Bost, may be 4 star, top 75-100 recruits. Bost is apparently an amazing athlete. Chris Wyse was 2nd team all state, was he not?

[jeffto]

I think Walker may be up there too. He ran the floor for Rice (top 25 HS program).

[MicksTheGuy]

Can Mike or someone else give me an idea about how good Wyse is? The last time I remember being excited about a highschool guy who didn't get much attention from us but really wanted to be a Bearcat was a pudgy kid named Logan.

From what I have seen on Bearcatnews he seems like a scorer. I would like to know more.


Who is Jason Clark? ESPN has him as a verbal for 2009?

[IKnowMoreThanYou]

The Jason Clark thing is a mistake, ESPN's recruiting coverage is spotty at best. He's actually committed to Georgetown, not UC. Haven't seen Wyse play so I can't comment on him.

[MikeInClifton]

Saw Wyse play for the first time in Pitt. Team was undisciplined so it was hard to pin him down. Is good physically, strong and can run the floor, but I would have to put him in fifth place behind the other four we've been discussing. Wyse is the tallest of the five, but you dont need 'tall' at the PG position.

[Nerf]

I want a point guard that is a 80%+ free throw shooter

I'd like the whole team to shoot 80%+ on free throws. They'd probably have won at least 4 of the games that they lost this past season if they'd have shot 80%.

[MicksTheGuy]

Mike:

Worder would you put these guys in as best fit for our team in 2008? I just don't get the feeling any of these guys are that highly rated right now. I know you can't always get the Gates ranked player but I thought we might be able to get a top 5 point guard in the 2008 class.

Theodore
Walker
Bost
Fortson
Wyse

[jrmac151]

Just wanted to throw a few more '08 names out there that have us listed on there board
Drazen Zlovaric 6'8"
Ray Shipman
Willie Warren(#13)
Tony Woods 6'11"
Chris Singleton 6'9"
Jared Swopshire
Teondre Williams

They are all in the top 150 (most in the 100)
nice to see Cincy back on multiple players list in the top 150!
Warren sounds like a stud! All have UC as a med interest level- a few have someone else high but most are all med - just wondering if anyone has anything on any of them. Maybe if Warren etc were the other three that were mentioned as signing in the near future

[waterhead]

Mike:

Worder would you put these guys in as best fit for our team in 2008? I just don't get the feeling any of these guys are that highly rated right now. I know you can't always get the Gates ranked player but I thought we might be able to get a top 5 point guard in the 2008 class.

Theodore
Walker
Bost
Fortson
Wyse

All the top PG's are already gone for 08' for the most part. These guys are all second tier as far as rankings go. A couple 4 star guys and a couple 3 star guys right now. Some on this board think the three star guys might move up the rankings next year since they are probably going to prep school now. I will take a 4 star PG since we already have Vaughn.

[MikeInClifton]

Mike:

Worder would you put these guys in as best fit for our team in 2008? I just don't get the feeling any of these guys are that highly rated right now. I know you can't always get the Gates ranked player but I thought we might be able to get a top 5 point guard in the 2008 class.

Theodore
Walker
Bost
Fortson
Wyse

Its hard enough for coaches to answer this question after seeing each of them play five+ times, so its very difficult for me to do so after seeing them each once. But here is my list today, in order -

Fortson
Bost
Walker
Theodore
Wyse

But remember - if Fortson is similiar to Yancy and wants to play close to home up east, there is nothing Mick can say to him that will change his mind.

Theodore and Walker are interesting given they currently play on a guard dominated team, with each other. The fact that they are currently on a team with another standout guard makes it quite similiar to what their college experience will be like. I'll do everything I can to see them this weekend.

[MikeInClifton]

Just wanted to throw a few more '08 names out there that have us listed on there board
Drazen Zlovaric 6'8"
Ray Shipman
Willie Warren(#13)
Tony Woods 6'11"
Chris Singleton 6'9"
Jared Swopshire
Teondre Williams

They are all in the top 150 (most in the 100)
nice to see Cincy back on multiple players list in the top 150!

I dont see Drazen as a Bearcat.
Saw Shropshire play as an 8th grader and you would have thought he was a senior in HS. Havent seen him since though.
I have been told Warren is quite the stud by folks who have seen him.

[jrmac151]

Warren could be a big get sounds like- and if any of the 6'9" kidss are ther- can't have enough and 1/2 usually don't pan out for us it seems

[IKnowMoreThanYou]

Willie Warren would be a statement recruit the likes of which UC has never seen. And he'd be the key to any chance the 'Cats would have to land his AAU mate Rotnei Clarke. J'Mison is interested in UC anyway and landing Willie would only enhance his interest in being a Bearcat.

[JerseySean]

I dont see Drazen as a Bearcat.
Saw Shropshire play as an 8th grader and you would have thought he was a senior in HS. Havent seen him since though.
I have been told Warren is quite the stud by folks who have seen him.

Ummm... I think Shropshire is a cheese... :)

[Oldtimer_UC_fan]

Willie Warren would be a statement recruit the likes of which UC has never seen. And he'd be the key to any chance the 'Cats would have to land his AAU mate Rotnei Clarke. J'Mison is interested in UC anyway and landing Willie would only enhance his interest in being a Bearcat.

Perhaps you've forgotten Dontonio Wingfield and Dermarr Johnson. Both of them were ranked in the top 5 recruits. But, Warren would sure be nice.

[MicksTheGuy]

I haven't seen much about Willie Warren so I'm not sure if we even have a shot at this kid. Do we? Can anyone even give me a website where it says he is considering us? When I see #13 by his name does that mean he is the 13th best player in his class?

IKNOW - I know nothing about Warren but I am pretty sure we have seen recruits like him or better. I'm not sure I will ever see a more gifted player then D. Wingfield. He was unreal. I have never seen a freshman play like that except maybe Durant this year and Melo.

[bengals21]

I really don't think Mick has a good shot of landing Willie Warren. We have been on his list every now and then but never with a high interest. From everything I have heard he is pretty high on Kansas and has been there for a visit.

[IKnowMoreThanYou]

Willie wouldn't come with the off court issues Wingfield had and when all is said and done he will be a top 10 recruit in a very deep class and the kind of scorer who unlike Wingfield and Dermar would likely be around for more than a year. A lot of top programs are on him but a decision isn't coming any time soon and UC's chances would go up if they could get him on campus for a visit.

Getting back into Texas is essential as they have top talent year in and year out and top players want to play with other top players. Things are looking for with Morgan and Bost though.

[Kindog202]

Things are looking for with Morgan and Bost though.[/QUOTE]

I assume you mean "Things are looking good/great for Morgan and Bost

Those 2 would be great gets for Mick. Bost could be groomed to be Vaughn's replacement and Morgan is another big body to replace Adam H. With the third and final scholarship for '08, I would like to see one of these 3 guys Teondre, Willie Warren or Paul Williams. If not then another big or possibly hold the scholly back for the '09 class and to help balance the classes a little bit.

[bengals21]

From everything I have heard I feel pretty confident in landing Bost. I'm not so sure about Morgan though. In his last couple updates I've read he didn't list UC. I know that might not mean anything but I guess I just would feel better about it if he did.

[Bearcat Fan Since 1958]

Willie wouldn't come with the off court issues Wingfield had and when all is said and done he will be a top 10 recruit in a very deep class and the kind of scorer who unlike Wingfield and Dermar would likely be around for more than a year. A lot of top programs are on him but a decision isn't coming any time soon and UC's chances would go up if they could get him on campus for a visit.

Getting back into Texas is essential as they have top talent year in and year out and top players want to play with other top players. Things are looking for with Morgan and Bost though.

Willie Warren will attend Kansas or Kentucky (most likely). UC has slim chance at him.

[Bearcat Fan Since 1958]

I really don't think Mick has a good shot of landing Willie Warren. We have been on his list every now and then but never with a high interest. From everything I have heard he is pretty high on Kansas and has been there for a visit.

Kansas or Kentucky.

[Bearcat Fan Since 1958]

Willie Warren would be a statement recruit the likes of which UC has never seen. And he'd be the key to any chance the 'Cats would have to land his AAU mate Rotnei Clarke. J'Mison is interested in UC anyway and landing Willie would only enhance his interest in being a Bearcat.

You surely must have heard of Oscar Robertson, George Wilson, Ron Bonham, Lloyd Batts, and similar Bearcats.

Each was much higher rated than Willie Warren.

[IKnowMoreThanYou]

You surely must have heard of Oscar Robertson, George Wilson, Ron Bonham, Lloyd Batts, and similar Bearcats.

Each was much higher rated than Willie Warren.

I was referring more to the modern resurgence of Bearcat hoops not necessarily all time recruits. Should have been more specific.

If there is one thing that's for sure about Willie is that nothing's for sure. He could really go anywhere. Kansas and Kentucky are certainly in there.

[Bearcat Fan Since 1958]

I was referring more to the modern resurgence of Bearcat hoops not necessarily all time recruits. Should have been more specific.

If there is one thing that's for sure about Willie is that nothing's for sure. He could really go anywhere. Kansas and Kentucky are certainly in there.

Herb Jones. Ruben Patterson. Danny Fortson. Each rated higher than Warren.

I simply cannot fathom how Warren can be considered the greatest UC recruit of the modern (post 1989) era.

[Bearcat98]

Courtney Fortson or Dee Bost in a few years.

Yep... One or the other will be here next year...

[waterhead]

Yep... One or the other will be here next year...

From what I have read I will take either one of those guys. Fortson or Bost sound like the kind of guys we want. If the recruiting class looks like this next year I will be extremely happy:

Morgan (C)
Gates (PF)
Wilkes (SF)
Williams (SG)
Fortson/Bost (PG)

It sounds like there is a good chance we will get Fortson or Bost and Gates and Wilkes are verbally committed. There are people who seem to be getting good vibes on Morgan and some who don't. I will trust the people with the inside track. This type of class would add some serious quality to our depth and would put us well on our way to making waves again as soon as 08' and definitely by 09'. I agree with the thought of hanging on to one or even two scholly's if we can't get studs at C and SG. We don't need to settle. I think we have enough guys to challenge at SG/Swing right now and we can fill in with PF to back up McClain next year if we can't get a stud center. Of course if McClain isn't ready we will have to sign a center no matter what since Adam H will be gone.

[subflea]

I dont see Drazen as a Bearcat.
Saw Shropshire play as an 8th grader and you would have thought he was a senior in HS. Havent seen him since though.
I have been told Warren is quite the stud by folks who have seen him.

A few months back Drazen mentioned us in an article in Tennessee. Today though at the King James Classic he said nothing of UC and mentioned a few Pac 10 schools including USC.