Sooners

[richard k.]

It's being reported that it is now official - UC will travel to Norman next year, the Sooners will return the favor (at PBS) in 2010. I think this is great - a 1/1with one of the great traditional powers in college football, but can someone explain to me why Oklahoma is a more "natural" opponent than Georgia?

[Bearcat85]

Why does Georgia become a part of this discussion? Is it just because we cancelled that game? (or did they?) I don't think there's anything more "natural" about it. Got rid of one game for some reason; now we have another.

[shaunsimpson]

Remind me. Was Georgia a 1 for 1? That is the only thing that I can think of. That or a alumni base thing.

[richard k.]

Georgia isn't really part of the discussion - but I was trying to understand playing Oklahoma when the Georgia series (I don't recall exactly but I thought it was a 1/1) was cancelled with the explanation that UC wanted to play more "natural" rivals. I'm thrilled with the Oklahoma series, but I'm having trouble understanding why the Sooners are a more "natural" rival than the Bulldogs. I haven't looked at an atlas, but I'm guessing Norman isn't any closer to Cincinnati than UGA. I'll be there to see UC play one of the most storied franchises in college football, it's just that adding this series doesn't square with the explanation given for cancelling the Georgia games.

[tophat]

Georgia was not a 1 for 1, as I recall. Pretty sure it was a 2 for 1. Also, this was set up thru the BE as an ESPN game.

[red_n_black_attack]

Tickets?? UGA, Oklahoma, doesn't matter much to me. I've seen the Hurricanes and Nittany Lions in Nippert. The obvious answer is money, but why not at Nippert? A home sell-out, scarcity of tickets could drive season ticket sales up enough to make up the difference of one game at PBS.

:p Though I'm confident season ticket sales will have a waiting list by 2010 :cool:

Let's support the kids, the program, and the University!
Go Cats!

[Bearcat_DF]

Three reasons for PBS -

1) - The biggest reason is that you can have an additional 34,000 people exposed to UC football!

2) - As you point out - by that time, avg attendance will be higher - if it is as high as 27-28K, the increased season tickets would be a basic wash with the extra 34K at PBS.

3) - It would be poor customer service. You won't build up a lot of good will with the college football fan who wants to see Oklahoma play. They would be bad mouthing the UC program all around town.

Go Cats!
DF




Tickets?? UGA, Oklahoma, doesn't matter much to me. I've seen the Hurricanes and Nittany Lions in Nippert. The obvious answer is money, but why not at Nippert? A home sell-out, scarcity of tickets could drive season ticket sales up enough to make up the difference of one game at PBS.

:p Though I'm confident season ticket sales will have a waiting list by 2010 :cool:

Let's support the kids, the program, and the University!
Go Cats!

[jkwuc89]

If PBS can be used as a bargaining chip to lure teams like Oklahoma to Cincinnati in home-and-home series that don't require a 2 for 1 agreement, I am all for it. Plus, PBS is an excellent place to watch football.

[red_n_black_attack]

I understand that PBS offer many plusses that Nippert can't match. Upgrading/expanding Nippert will not happen before 2010.

I just think the intangibles of having marquee match-ups on campus are not to be discounted. A bustling campus filled with pre-game activites, building strong memories and bonds for current students, while taking a stroll down memory lane for we alums...

In order for this to happen on campus, we (and all of our friends, casual contacts, and anyone we meet) need to get our butts in seats at Nippert to fill the stadium to capacity every game. Then and only then can we start asking for or believe we are deserving of expansion.

Once we get to that point, my fear is that expansion talks would be squelched because we have PBS as a nice alternative for the really big games like Oklahoma or Ohio State. As for giving fans of the "national powers" an opportunity to see their team, I don't really care. This is a home game and the first priority should be to ensure that our fans are louder than theirs. I am okay with 35000 UC fans and 2000 Oklahoma fans at the game if it means that season tickets are the only way to get a seat. With season ticket sales somewhere under 10000 currently, the 25000 extra tickets sold (most of them will be used because BK will put an exciting and winning product on the field) for 6 other games would cancel out the 40000 extra tickets to one game!

When Ohio State played us at PBS, there were more OSU fans. It is like ND playing in Orlando or Kentucky playing Miami at the Colesium. We are not playing the game for their fans. I accept that PBS is a very nice football facility, and the national exposure (highlights on all major sports coverage as we beat them by 3 TD's) with a packed house is cool. I would just like to give the decided home advantage to our kids. Playing a good non-confernece opponent should be reason enough to play UC, not getting exposure to a region. Certainly Oklahoma is thinking that they can use this game to improve recruiting against Ohio State, but we'll give them a good quality game.

[Bearcat_DF]

Red n Black,

I agree. I don't know if you have read any of the C-USA Board's response to BK's comments about UC fans wanting to see Oregon State over USM. In the midst of it is an important point.

UC needs to create fans of the UC football program.

So regardless of the opponent or the venue, our fans are there. Period.

I believe we are heading in the right direction. I think we have four opportunities this year to create the kind of atmosphere you describe (Oregon State, UWV, U of L, and Marshall).

At least 2 should be sell outs if not all four! We do not need to wait till 2010 or for an Oklahoma to strengthen our fan base. Hopefully, by 2010, this issue will be a moot point.

From my perspective, we can have our cake and eat it too. Make Nippert a great football experience, and make a cool extra $250k to help pay for the Nippert expansion!

Go Cats!
DF

[Bearcat85]

"When Ohio State played us at PBS, there were more OSU fans."

I don't believe this is true. I'll give you low 40's percent, but not "more".

As for OU in 2010, I truly believe that by then, there will be many more UC fans wanting tickets, and also, OU fans aren't in as close proximity (in great numbers) to be able to jump on the chance early. The will travel well, but not like OSU, thereby giving UC fans more chance to get tickets.

[ewad]

The Georgia deal was a 2 for 1. This is a straight up matchup.

[Bearcat_DF]

Another advantage of playing at PBS

I think playing at PBS is an advantage for recruiting. I can remember when I was in high school in Dayton. The city schools share Welcome stadium with the U of Dayton and it has turf. It was a big deal to play there. Other teams got excited about playing on a college field and on turf.

So, I can imagine that the opportunity to play in an NFL venue is a positive for UC in recruiting players. Oklahoma thinks so - "We’re also excited that the game in Ohio affords us the opportunity to take Bob Stoops back to his home state while introducing our team to another NFL venue.”

http://www.normantranscript.com/ousports/local_story_220004846.html

The real challenge will be to fill the place. OU won't travel as many as OSU did, so I think we will have a little bit of a gap between UC fans, OU fans, and 69k.

Go Cats!
DF

[tophat]

Nobody loves Nippert more than I do, BUT:

You're not going to get the Oklahomas of college football to play at Nippert. For one thing, a team like Oklahoma can bring 25,000 on a road trip, and it's a major plus to them to have a road game their fans can travel to. They can pick and choose among places where they'd like to play, and Nippert is not among them.

With logistical considerations being as they are, don't look for Nippert to undergo the type of expansion that would enable it to accomodate 50,000 or so people. I doubt if Nippert will ever grow to much over 40 to 42,000. It's smack in the middle of a very congested area of campus, limiting expansion options, that is, without having upper decks practically run into important buildings. It would be in very poor taste, which is why you're never likely to see it. PBS will be used for mega crowds.

[bearcatmark]

"When Ohio State played us at PBS, there were more OSU fans."

I don't believe this is true. I'll give you low 40's percent, but not "more".

As for OU in 2010, I truly believe that by then, there will be many more UC fans wanting tickets, and also, OU fans aren't in as close proximity (in great numbers) to be able to jump on the chance early. The will travel well, but not like OSU, thereby giving UC fans more chance to get tickets.



Agreed... I was at the game, I'd say it was between 55 and 60 percent UC fans, and 40-45 percent OSU... I mean it sucked that it was that close, but there were more UC fans. Really that was an amazing atmosphere for a game to be played in too. Quite fun. Though i'd rather pack it with 95% bearcat fans.

[swilsonsp4]

[QUOTE=Bearcat_DF;4491]Another advantage of playing at PBS

So, I can imagine that the opportunity to play in an NFL venue is a positive for UC in recruiting players.]

While it's probably a good idea to use PBS for the occasional big-time, out-of-conference matchup, I hope UC doesn't expand its schedule there. For several years, until Nippert was upgraded (15 years ago?), the Cats played all of their "home" games at Riverfront Stadium, an NFL facility. The attendance was no better (perhaps worse) than it has been in recent years and the atmosphere was sanitary and boring. Even games against Penn State and The U failed to draw attention. Recruiting was not impacted favorably.

Winning is more important than the venue in attracting recruits, given that the team doesn't play in a dump. And, Nippert is no dump. It's small, but a great place to watch a game.

[ctipton]

If the 2010 game at PBS is part of the season ticket package, I can imagine season ticket sales going up tremendously. What a lot of people don't understand is that fans of the Top 25 programs travel all over the country and travel very well. If we still have all of our home games for a measly $60, look for OU fans to buy up to 15K season tickets just to get into PBS. Great deal for a program like that.

[ctipton]

UC, Sooners meet on equal terms

By Josh Katzowitz
Post staff reporter

Oklahoma football coach Bob Stoops wills bring his team to Cincinnati in 2010 to play the UC Bearcats in a deal finalized Tuesday. Story, page 3B.

University of Cincinnati athletic director Mike Thomas and football coach Brian Kelly aren't interested in scheduling big-name opponents if they have to make major concessions.

And they definitely don't want to play at an opponents' home stadium twice to get one contest at Nippert Stadium - a 2-for-1 deal, in other words.

They've done it with Ohio State - the Bearcats played in Columbus in 1999, 2004 and 2006 and will travel there in 2014, and the Buckeyes met UC at Paul Brown Stadium in 2002 and will appear there again in 2012.

But a potential 2-for-1 deal with Georgia didn't materialize, because in part, Thomas isn't keen on signing that kind of contract.

Thomas and Kelly say UC is a Bowl Championship Series program now. They want straight-up home-and-homes, like the one the Bearcats made official with Oklahoma on Tuesday. They don't want to make concessions for hardly anybody.

The days of 2-for-1s, for the most part, are over.

"I can't speak for the previous administration, but at one point in time, we weren't a BCS school," Thomas said during UC's football media day Tuesday. "For us to play schools in a 2-for-1 right now, it'd be a very, very short list. You can count them on one hand."

Oklahoma obviously isn't included in that list. The Bearcats will travel to Norman on Sept. 6, 2008, and receive $300,000 for their trouble, and the Sooners will return the trip Sept. 25, 2010, at Paul Brown Stadium and receive the same amount of money from UC.

For a Bearcats squad looking to play in the upper echelon of a BCS conference, this kind of matchup is exactly what Kelly wants.

"If you want championships, you have to play those teams," Kelly said. "They're only going to make you better. Do I want to play four of them? No, I'll play one of them. The other four are teams we can compete with."

The Oklahoma game completes next season's non-conference schedule, and it's the type of ledger Kelly wants to see. On Aug. 30, 2008, the Bearcats will open their season against Division I-AA opponent Eastern Kentucky.

After the Oklahoma and Miami University contests, UC will play Akron and Marshall. While those latter two games are on the road, Akron and Marshall represent the opponents the Bearcats don't mind playing before the Big East schedule begins.

"Right now, you want to have balance in your schedule as far as your competition level," Thomas said. "You do want to play some national teams. When you play Mid-American Conference-type teams, the goal should be that those in our footprint makes sense. Marshall is a natural rivalry for us. But absolutely, the ones who get our fans excited are the ones like Oklahoma."

The Sooners, coached by Bob Stoops, have won four Big 12 championships since 1999 and earned the national title in 2000. Since Stoops took over the program, Oklahoma, not counting the eight wins in 2005 that were vacated after the NCAA discovered rules violations, has compiled a 78-18 record.

Thomas wouldn't mind playing host to the Sooners at Nippert Stadium, but he's content with Paul Brown Stadium as well.

"Those kind of programs want to play in front of 75,000-80,000 people," Thomas said. "Right now, unless you put a mirror at one end of the stadium, we're somewhere closer to 35,000. ... I think they'll travel well, but I'm very optimistic that our program will be at a level where people can see it's a great national matchup."

BOLTON OUT - Kelly said Tuesday that senior offensive lineman Jeremy Bolton, who played 10 games as a reserve last year, has quit the team. Bolton, a Conner High School product, told Kelly on Sunday his heart no longer was in the game, but Kelly said Bolton returned Monday and asked to reclaim his spot.

Kelly declined, saying the decision already had been made

"I didn't want him to quit," Kelly said. "He was a senior, and his teammates didn't want him to quit. But I'm 0-for-86 when it comes to trying to talk guys out of quitting."

http://news.cincypost.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070808/SPT0201/708080333/1035/SPT

[Bearcat_DF]

For several years, until Nippert was upgraded (15 years ago?), the Cats played all of their "home" games at Riverfront Stadium, an NFL facility. The attendance was no better (perhaps worse) than it has been in recent years and the atmosphere was sanitary and boring. Even games against Penn State and The U failed to draw attention. Recruiting was not impacted favorably.


Shaun,

I know, I was a student during that period and it was terrible going to Riverfront. I would never advocate playing many games at PBS. But it is a different era. The Nippert Experience should continue to grow. Most games will be there, so students will have a great experience. PBS is not Riverfront. So I think a big game every other year would be a great component now.

As others have pointed out - OU won't be coming to Nippert and Nippert can't grow. Beside, I don't see UC having the money to expand Nippert anytime soon. Finally, I hope UC would build a new basketball arena before expanding Nippert.

Go Cats!
df