View Full Version : OT Louisville Hires Teague's Coach
Helicopter
09-07-2009, 01:31 AM
U of L hired Marquis Teague's (2010 #1 PG) head coach from high school. His title is "Special Assistant to the Coach".
I hate this kind of blatant blue chipping.
http://www.zagsblog.com/2009/09/01/pitts-brown-suspended-wvus-mazzulla-reinstated-acker-returns-to-marquette-shaq-thomas-settles-on-a-school/#more-21356
CincyEngGrad02
09-07-2009, 03:44 AM
I'm ok with these kind of hires. But it won't matter, coach Cronin will get Teague!
London 'Cat
09-07-2009, 07:50 AM
It does not pass the smell test to me. It creates the appearance of impropriety by the school, ie "buying" the recruit by hiring people close to him. It should not be allowed, IMO.
Bearcat Fan Since 1958
09-07-2009, 08:23 AM
U of L hired Marquis Teague's (2010 #1 PG) head coach from high school. His title is "Special Assistant to the Coach".
I hate this kind of blatant blue chipping.
http://www.zagsblog.com/2009/09/01/pitts-brown-suspended-wvus-mazzulla-reinstated-acker-returns-to-marquette-shaq-thomas-settles-on-a-school/#more-21356
They hired the ASSISTANT coach from his HS team.
Pitino has done that before. UC did that under Gale Catlett in 1974 (hired Steve Collier's HS coach Jim Mitchell).
CincyEngGrad02
09-07-2009, 08:59 AM
It does not pass the smell test to me. It creates the appearance of impropriety by the school, ie "buying" the recruit by hiring people close to him. It should not be allowed, IMO.
How do you police it? Do you not hire anybody that knows the kid? His current coaches? Past coaches? Relatives? What if its a relative that he is not close to and doesn't like, is it ok then? What if his current coach happens to be a heckuva upcoming coach that any college would be lucky to have?
London 'Cat
09-07-2009, 09:14 AM
How do you police it? Do you not hire anybody that knows the kid? His current coaches? Past coaches? Relatives? What if its a relative that he is not close to and doesn't like, is it ok then? What if his current coach happens to be a heckuva upcoming coach that any college would be lucky to have?
You don't hire anyone that has direct influence over the player's decision on where to attend school and play ball. Period. It's an ethical issue, IMO. And recruiting is one of the most unethical practices there is. IMO, it does not pass muster to hire a coach in an obvious effort to sway a recruit's decision in favor of your school.
JerseySean
09-07-2009, 09:16 AM
Maybe Pitino thinks the assistant coach has a hot wife...
CincyEngGrad02
09-07-2009, 09:40 AM
You don't hire anyone that has direct influence over the player's decision on where to attend school and play ball. Period. It's an ethical issue, IMO. And recruiting is one of the most unethical practices there is. IMO, it does not pass muster to hire a coach in an obvious effort to sway a recruit's decision in favor of your school.
I"m not trying to be difficult, but again how do you define "direct influence"? There's a million difference scenarios I could throw out there similar to the ones I provided earlier.
The whole topic is way too subjective to police/regulate. Plus it can have a negative effect on those people that could potentially be hired because they actually have the skills desired for an assistant coach. And its not fair to punish someone just because they know or are close to a very good recruit.
westsidecat
09-07-2009, 11:13 AM
Really, as much as some don't like it, there's nothing wrong with it. This happens everyyear, and it will contiune. Ville, and others who do this are not breaking any rules.
From what I have read, M.T said it won't effect his choice at all.
westsidecat
09-07-2009, 11:39 AM
http://www.indystar.com/article/20090904/SPORTS0615/90904048/1361/SPORTS0615/Teague+downplays+Louisville+hire++adds+UNC+to+list
London 'Cat
09-07-2009, 12:57 PM
I"m not trying to be difficult, but again how do you define "direct influence"? There's a million difference scenarios I could throw out there similar to the ones I provided earlier.
The whole topic is way too subjective to police/regulate. Plus it can have a negative effect on those people that could potentially be hired because they actually have the skills desired for an assistant coach. And its not fair to punish someone just because they know or are close to a very good recruit.
You're not going to change my mind on this topic. It's an obvious attempt to sway the player's decision in favor of the school hiring the coach/relative/friend/mentor, etc. It does not pass my smell test. It gives the appearance of impropriety. I don't like it. I don't know how to curb drug trafficking either. Just because we can't police something does not make it appropriate.
London 'Cat
09-07-2009, 01:02 PM
Really, as much as some don't like it, there's nothing wrong with it. This happens everyyear, and it will contiune. Ville, and others who do this are not breaking any rules.
From what I have read, M.T said it won't effect his choice at all.
I understand it is not prohibited. I just don't think it's ethical, that's all. It makes the college hiring the assistant, or whatever position he gets, look sleazy, IMPO. It seems Teague is above such seedy tactics as indicated by his quote in the article. He has quite a mature outlook on it, IMO.
Apparently Pitino has had a relationship with this guy for a while now and Teague's family claim the move is for the coaches future and will not influence him. It is the next step in a coaching career, form HS to College. It looks bad but this guy has a ton of Indiana connections and I would say it is for future recruiting not Teague's.
Teague does not know where he is going to go to school. This is not having an impact on his decision. He is visiting UC on Sept. 26th(Again) and will be back to UK and OSU. He was supposedly at UL this past weekend. UL had 5 studs on campus. They did not hire any of there coaches though.
UCbball21
09-07-2009, 01:40 PM
I think Teague ends up at UL with or without this hiring...per Jerry West's twitter he said 2 5-stars were ready to commit. Wouldn't suprise me if one of those guys was Teague. I think we have a much better shot with Kendrick.
juckerrules
09-07-2009, 01:59 PM
I understand it is not prohibited. I just don't think it's ethical, that's all. It makes the college hiring the assistant, or whatever position he gets, look sleazy, IMPO. It seems Teague is above such seedy tactics as indicated by his quote in the article. He has quite a mature outlook on it, IMO.
Generally speaking, college athletics+coach+ethics+recruiting = one big collective oxymoron
nolte50uc
09-07-2009, 02:01 PM
to play devil's advocate, how many of you were happy when UC hired kerry combs - knowing it would help attract the colerain players? was that OK and ethical?
Thegreatone
09-07-2009, 02:12 PM
thats fair. But that wasnt to land someone inparticular
CincyEngGrad02
09-07-2009, 03:17 PM
Generally speaking, college athletics+coach+ethics+recruiting = one big collective oxymoron
No doubt. The entire system is pretty much a joke. Giving scholarships away to kids who everyone knows has no intention of staying 4 years and getting a degree. Much bigger fish to fry than hiring people to get 5 star players.
westsidecat
09-07-2009, 03:29 PM
I think Teague ends up at UL with or without this hiring...per Jerry West's twitter he said 2 5-stars were ready to commit. Wouldn't suprise me if one of those guys was Teague. I think we have a much better shot with Kendrick.
I agree. I wrote Teague off about two months ago. I would be very surprised if he comes here. I also felt he would end up in Ville before any of this.
columbus_bearcat
09-07-2009, 05:19 PM
I think Teague ends up at UL with or without this hiring...per Jerry West's twitter he said 2 5-stars were ready to commit. Wouldn't suprise me if one of those guys was Teague. I think we have a much better shot with Kendrick.
Actually, it was Jerry Smith's twitter page. Smith is a player on their current roster. So I would take anything he says with a grain of salt. That being said, I also think Teague will be in 'Ville uniform when he gets to college.
thats fair. But that wasnt to land someone inparticular
Several teams hire coaches to get one player. Coombs was hired to get all of the good players at Colerain. I love the hire. It is a little different b/c he is a hometown guy with alot of heart for Cincinnati(still for the same reason as the rest, with the addition that he is a great coach) However, it was a hire to make a much bigger impact than just one player.
UL did not hire this guy for Teague. It is also for the future. This guy is like a Coombs in Indiana with hoops. It is a good hire and one player it is not the reason.
Ole Skool Bearcat
09-07-2009, 11:31 PM
This is the way big time College Basketball is played;
psax889906
09-08-2009, 01:14 AM
Several teams hire coaches to get one player. Coombs was hired to get all of the good players at Colerain.
That's not true... getting a pipeline to Colerain was not an issue at all for UC... they were getting their share of talent from Colerain... they missed out on a few of the blue chippers that were on that '04 team but UC wasn't a national program back then... Coombs was hired, imo, 1st as a local recruiter for all of the Greater tri-state area... 2nd as a DB's coach, he's a tireless worker and is going to get 110% from his guys... and then a nice fringe benefit is the Colerain connection... it's not like UC was recruiting a Top 100 football player from Colerain the year Coombs went to UC...
blackattack
09-08-2009, 07:50 AM
That's not true... getting a pipeline to Colerain was not an issue at all for UC... they were getting their share of talent from Colerain... they missed out on a few of the blue chippers that were on that '04 team but UC wasn't a national program back then... Coombs was hired, imo, 1st as a local recruiter for all of the Greater tri-state area... 2nd as a DB's coach, he's a tireless worker and is going to get 110% from his guys... and then a nice fringe benefit is the Colerain connection... it's not like UC was recruiting a Top 100 football player from Colerain the year Coombs went to UC...
That's correct. By the time Coombs was hired by BK the blue chippers on that Colerain team had already declared for Michigan and O$U.
Here's the bottom line.......UK and UL have been doing this crap for years. Pitino hired several relatives and high school coaches when he was at UK in order to secure a number of big time recruits. I don't care what anybody says.....it amounts to buying a recruit. And I won't change my mind if UC starts doing it. Pure and simple.
cspeed
09-08-2009, 10:43 AM
Maybe Pitino thinks the assistant coach has a hot wife...
Thats FUNNY !!!
bearcatbret
09-08-2009, 01:43 PM
to play devil's advocate, how many of you were happy when UC hired kerry combs - knowing it would help attract the colerain players? was that OK and ethical?
I think this is totally different. BK came to UC by himself and had no other coaches. He looked for the biggest name locally to help get himself established. KC was hired to attract all local kids to UC not just one player from one school.
As a side note, when MD left UC for MSU, he gave his staff an ultimatum of you come with me now or you do not come and then took the entire staff. Where as BK left his existing staff in place to finish coaching through the bowl season and then extended the offer to them to come to UC afterward. MD bailed on his players at UC and stuck them without a coach for a few weeks trying to prepare for a bowl game. That is why I will not respect what MD did at UC.
jon b
09-09-2009, 11:43 AM
They hired the ASSISTANT coach from his HS team.
Pitino has done that before. UC did that under Gale Catlett in 1974 (hired Steve Collier's HS coach Jim Mitchell).
Bet ya Catlett would take that back now if he could. :) (Hasn't Mitchell always been considered the Asst. Coach that ratted to the NCAA before he left for Detroit or wherever?)
That's correct. By the time Coombs was hired by BK the blue chippers on that Colerain team had already declared for Michigan and O$U.
Here's the bottom line.......UK and UL have been doing this crap for years. Pitino hired several relatives and high school coaches when he was at UK in order to secure a number of big time recruits. I don't care what anybody says.....it amounts to buying a recruit. And I won't change my mind if UC starts doing it. Pure and simple.
You guys obviously have no idea how big of a role Coombs played in getting the Colerain players to UC. Guess who was informed of this when he arrived at UC. Then the decision was made to look into the hire and whether or not it could help with other local recruiting The rest is history.
psax889906
09-10-2009, 05:36 AM
You guys obviously have no idea how big of a role Coombs played in getting the Colerain players to UC. Guess who was informed of this when he arrived at UC. Then the decision was made to look into the hire and whether or not it could help with other local recruiting The rest is history.
Once again, the facts simply don't support your argument... the elite level talent that Colerain produced from their state title team was before Kelly's time and didn't take a second glance at UC (Connor Smith, Terrence Sherrer, Eugene Clifford (Coombs was hired right before he committed to OSU I believe), Mister Simpson, Cobrani Mixon, Tyler Moeller)... Byrd and Goodman were under the radar recruits and Justin Moore was a walk-on to start I believe... did the Coombs hire help with the recruitment of Brandon Mills (who had the safety in the game vs. Rutgers btw :) ) and Evan Davis?... I'm sure it did... but I'm not sure why you're trying to force something into your argument that just simply isn't there...
Helicopter
09-10-2009, 08:21 AM
I"m not trying to be difficult, but again how do you define "direct influence"? There's a million difference scenarios I could throw out there similar to the ones I provided earlier.
The whole topic is way too subjective to police/regulate. Plus it can have a negative effect on those people that could potentially be hired because they actually have the skills desired for an assistant coach. And its not fair to punish someone just because they know or are close to a very good recruit.
Business 101. If you have to ask about the ethics involved it probably is unethical.
Once again, the facts simply don't support your argument... the elite level talent that Colerain produced from their state title team was before Kelly's time and didn't take a second glance at UC (Connor Smith, Terrence Sherrer, Eugene Clifford (Coombs was hired right before he committed to OSU I believe), Mister Simpson, Cobrani Mixon, Tyler Moeller)... Byrd and Goodman were under the radar recruits and Justin Moore was a walk-on to start I believe... did the Coombs hire help with the recruitment of Brandon Mills (who had the safety in the game vs. Rutgers btw :) ) and Evan Davis?... I'm sure it did... but I'm not sure why you're trying to force something into your argument that just simply isn't there...
You are making my point about why he was hired under Kelly. It was not b/c of the big time players he did not send to UC when he was at Colerain. It was to get the best from Colerain from here on out and to keep the big local talent.
The guy was hired to get the big talent at Colerain due to his connections to families in the district and others around the city that have influence on some of the players that go to Colerain. Also, to use his connections with other teams. There is no way around this.
psax889906
09-11-2009, 01:07 AM
You are making my point about why he was hired under Kelly. It was not b/c of the big time players he did not send to UC when he was at Colerain. It was to get the best from Colerain from here on out and to keep the big local talent.
The guy was hired to get the big talent at Colerain due to his connections to families in the district and others around the city that have influence on some of the players that go to Colerain. Also, to use his connections with other teams. There is no way around this.
And thus you have made my point... these are two VERY different things...
Scenario 1:
A highly heralded and heavily recruited player can have his choice of any school in the country... his recruitment seems wide open. School A suddenly hires his Uncle/AAU Coach/HS Coach and a few weeks later he commits to said school.
Scenario 2:
A Head Coach at a BCS school realizes a local high school coach has all the necessary tools and connections to help both in player development and recruiting locally. He offers the coach a position and the coach accepts. Fringe benefits occur when a few players that were flying under the radar on the recruiting trail follow him.
I consider Scenario 2 to be completely legit and it simply makes sense. I consider Scenario 1 to be slimy, unethical and manipulating the system.
And thus you have made my point... these are two VERY different things...
Scenario 1:
A highly heralded and heavily recruited player can have his choice of any school in the country... his recruitment seems wide open. School A suddenly hires his Uncle/AAU Coach/HS Coach and a few weeks later he commits to said school.
Scenario 2:
A Head Coach at a BCS school realizes a local high school coach has all the necessary tools and connections to help both in player development and recruiting locally. He offers the coach a position and the coach accepts. Fringe benefits occur when a few players that were flying under the radar on the recruiting trail follow him.
I consider Scenario 2 to be completely legit and it simply makes sense. I consider Scenario 1 to be slimy, unethical and manipulating the system.
The guy that UL hired was not hired for Teague. He was hired for the same reason as Coombs. His connections in Indy are the best of the best. Teague has been a UL lean for a while and is still considering 5 or 6 schools including UC. Have you seen the talent UL is landing right now with no other HS coaches being hired?
This is far from a situation where John Calipari hired Dejaun Wagner's coach(then he left), Tyreke Evans High School strength coach(then he left) and several other examples that Cal has. This coach will be at UL for as long as Pitino is and probably much longer or will move on to another school. It just so happens Teague played for him. This guy has a future in college coaching and was going to get promoted to a big time school in the near future. So a hall of fame coach grabbed him to help recruit an incredibly talent loaded state for the next 2 years and probably longer.
Pay attention to what talen comes out of Indiana in 2011 and 2012. YOu will see what I am talking about.
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