Everyone needs to relax

[bearcatn8]

I think everyone needs to calm down. People, you have to remember what Cronin inherited when he took the team over - a team with virtually no returning big east quality players and no active recruiting. Yes, we have Gentry, Sikes, Williamson etc. back from last year. But remember, these guys were available when Mick got them for a reason. They are nice mid-major players, but NOT Big East quality players.

This basically is a team of Freshman and Vaughn, with their best low post player (Williams) out for the year.

Mick may or may not ultimately be able to bring the 'Cats back to national prominence, but it is IMPOSSIBLE to judge him until he has had at least three years to try and rebuild this team.

Yes, the loss to Belmont was bad, but keep things in perspective. This program was all but destroyed by the actions of those who shall not be named, it can't be rebuilt overnight. What we want to see is solid improvement by the Freshmen and continued development by Vaughn during the course of the season.

If at the end of the year those guys are making the same mistakes . . . when then, it is time to start getting a little worried. But not until then . . .

[Bearcat Fan Since 1958]

I think everyone needs to calm down. People, you have to remember what Cronin inherited when he took the team over - a team with virtually no returning big east quality players and no active recruiting. Yes, we have Gentry, Sikes, Williamson etc. back from last year. But remember, these guys were available when Mick got them for a reason. They are nice mid-major players, but NOT Big East quality players.

This basically is a team of Freshman and Vaughn, with their best low post player (Williams) out for the year.

Mick may or may not ultimately be able to bring the 'Cats back to national prominence, but it is IMPOSSIBLE to judge him until he has had at least three years to try and rebuild this team.

Yes, the loss to Belmont was bad, but keep things in perspective. This program was all but destroyed by the actions of those who shall not be named, it can't be rebuilt overnight. What we want to see is solid improvement by the Freshmen and continued development by Vaughn during the course of the season.

If at the end of the year those guys are making the same mistakes . . . when then, it is time to start getting a little worried. But not until then . . .

It took UC 3 years to return to national prominence after Yates was let go in 1989. But that also included NCAA probation due to recruiting infractions.

I'd be surprised to see UC in national prominence by 2010 (3 years). It will take longer than that. The basketball program started from scratch in 2006.

But REGARDLESS the Bearcats MUST beat teams like Belmont at home.

[bearcatn8]

You can't really compare what Mick has had to face with Huggins after Yates. When Huggins first arrived on campus, he inherited a very solid nucleus (Starks, Banks, Robinson, etc). It was not an NCAA nucleus, but it certainly was a postseason worthy nucleus.

Cronin inherited a program with less returning D-1 experience than NKU.

In any event, I agree that they need to beat teams like Belmont at home. But during the first few years of this rebuilding process, you can't take anything for granted. Just too much parity in college basketball as it is. Again, the key will be the improvement of the freshman and Vaughn as the season progresses. If they develop into a solid nucleus, then there is a lot to be positive about for the next few years and, ultimately, no more losses to teams like Belmont at home.

[Kindog202]

Mark it down (and I know some of you will), this team will be a Top 10 team in the country as soon as Vaughn's senior year. At Texas A&M, Gillespie's first team went 0-16 in conference with a freshman point guard named Acie Law. Four years later, that team with a senior point guard named Acie Law finished second in the Big 12 and was highly ranked throughout the entire season. UC will track along the same path.

[Bearcat Revival]

"Here you go, Coach. We've given you the Death Penalty. Good luck making the NCAA tourney in three years. You better, or we're going to say mean things about you."

Get real, people!!

[SLMadiCat]

Mark it down (and I know some of you will), this team will be a Top 10 team in the country as soon as Vaughn's senior year. At Texas A&M, Gillespie's first team went 0-16 in conference with a freshman point guard named Acie Law. Four years later, that team with a senior point guard named Acie Law finished second in the Big 12 and was highly ranked throughout the entire season. UC will track along the same path.

I hope you are right. As long as the recruiting stays strong, I have no reason not to believe you. Vaughn is going to be really good and the Freshman have great potential. Add in Gates, Wright and company and it's a recipe for success. Lets just hope for some luck along the way.

[Bearcat Fan Since 1958]

Mark it down (and I know some of you will), this team will be a Top 10 team in the country as soon as Vaughn's senior year. At Texas A&M, Gillespie's first team went 0-16 in conference with a freshman point guard named Acie Law. Four years later, that team with a senior point guard named Acie Law finished second in the Big 12 and was highly ranked throughout the entire season. UC will track along the same path.

Gillispie was at TAMU for 3 seasons (2005, 06, 07). Law was a soph in 2005 when TAMU was 21-10. They were NOT 0-16 in B12 that year.

[Bearcat Fan Since 1958]

You can't really compare what Mick has had to face with Huggins after Yates. When Huggins first arrived on campus, he inherited a very solid nucleus (Starks, Banks, Robinson, etc). It was not an NCAA nucleus, but it certainly was a postseason worthy nucleus.

Cronin inherited a program with less returning D-1 experience than NKU.

In any event, I agree that they need to beat teams like Belmont at home. But during the first few years of this rebuilding process, you can't take anything for granted. Just too much parity in college basketball as it is. Again, the key will be the improvement of the freshman and Vaughn as the season progresses. If they develop into a solid nucleus, then there is a lot to be positive about for the next few years and, ultimately, no more losses to teams like Belmont at home.

That's what I said. It was easier then but it still took 3 years.

It's tougher now. If it happens, it will not be in 3 years.

[jkwuc89]

We seem to have a lot of "so-called" experts who know how long this will take. Answer me this, how many of you have actually coached or played at the D-1 level? I am guessing ZERO! One loss does not a season break. Just ask Kentucky who got drilled by Gardner Webb at home. The season is a marathon and not a sprint. Now is not the time to throw the team and the coaches under the bus. Yes...the loss was ugly but Belmont is going to be pretty good this season (I believe they were picked 1st in their league).

[Kindog202]

I assume you think they won't return to national prominence ever under Cronin? If not, how long then.

Here is why I believe they will be nationally prominent again by the time Vaughn is a senior. This is a potential starting lineup Vaughn's senior year based only on what is known right now.

Vaughn, Mitchell, Wilks, Williams, McClain w/a bench of Wright, Davis, Bishop, Gates, Belton, McElroy (or put Gates in the lineup if Williams is not granted a 6th year) plus 2 remaining schollys which should go to a long range shooter and a true center. Everyone on that team with the exception of McElroy will have had a least a year in school, all of the starters at least will be headed into their third year of Mick's system. They will have the size, athleticism talent and experience to match most teams in the country. Through experience, they should develop and be able to match skills with most teams in the country. I don't really see anyone leaving early from this team except for maybe McClain due to his size and if he "gets it" w/i the next 2 years.

I know it seems like a long way off because we had been spoiled by winning for so long, but I truly believe they will be nationally prominent sooner rather than later. Mick is rebuilding the right way.

[Bp4thebest]

Gillispie was at TAMU for 3 seasons (2005, 06, 07). Law was a soph in 2005 when TAMU was 21-10. They were NOT 0-16 in B12 that year.

haha if this is right then he proved u wrong and prove your arguement wrong.. this is not the same situation as them.. well sorta but not exactly.. they were a little more talented to start

[Bp4thebest]

We seem to have a lot of "so-called" experts who know how long this will take. Answer me this, how many of you have actually coached or played at the D-1 level? I am guessing ZERO! One loss does not a season break. Just ask Kentucky who got drilled by Gardner Webb at home. The season is a marathon and not a sprint. Now is not the time to throw the team and the coaches under the bus. Yes...the loss was ugly but Belmont is going to be pretty good this season (I believe they were picked 1st in their league).

second behind the team that beat uk.. gardner-webb.. so i hear.. non the less belmont is good!

[Bp4thebest]

I assume you think they won't return to national prominence ever under Cronin? If not, how long then.

Here is why I believe they will be nationally prominent again by the time Vaughn is a senior. This is a potential starting lineup Vaughn's senior year based only on what is known right now.

Vaughn, Mitchell, Wilks, Williams, McClain w/a bench of Wright, Davis, Bishop, Gates, Belton, McElroy (or put Gates in the lineup if Williams is not granted a 6th year) plus 2 remaining schollys which should go to a long range shooter and a true center. Everyone on that team with the exception of McElroy will have had a least a year in school, all of the starters at least will be headed into their third year of Mick's system. They will have the size, athleticism talent and experience to match most teams in the country. Through experience, they should develop and be able to match skills with most teams in the country. I don't really see anyone leaving early from this team except for maybe McClain due to his size and if he "gets it" w/i the next 2 years.

I know it seems like a long way off because we had been spoiled by winning for so long, but I truly believe they will be nationally prominent sooner rather than later. Mick is rebuilding the right way.

on paper this looks good.. and rebuilding the right way.. h*** yes! in terms of players that is.. we still have to see how well he can develoe this talent as players.. and we still dont know what his system is b/c last year he didnt have a full roster and def not a full big east roster! lets see how well he coaches with a full team of talent! that will determine whether or not that team can be top 10... potential is there!

[Catmandu]

We seem to have a lot of "so-called" experts who know how long this will take. Answer me this, how many of you have actually coached or played at the D-1 level? I am guessing ZERO! One loss does not a season break. Just ask Kentucky who got drilled by Gardner Webb at home. The season is a marathon and not a sprint. Now is not the time to throw the team and the coaches under the bus. Yes...the loss was ugly but Belmont is going to be pretty good this season (I believe they were picked 1st in their league).


since you've called a few out... frankly I've always thought this was a pretty weak argument. Normally reserved for when there aren't any facts to back and opinion.

If this point had any validity, or was widely recognized, then there are only two people on earth who could critique President Bush... Bush Sr and Carter.... because they are the only two alive who have been president of the U.S.

I don't think you have to have been a coach to be able to identify good coaching or bad coaching. Just because one didn't choose to go that direction in their career choice doesn't mean their opinion isn't educated.

not only that... although I agree 100% with your main point, with you not having ever been a Div 1 coach, didn't you just throw all your opinions out with the bath water? you would be part of the Zero right? So why should there be any creedence in the "now is not the time to throw the team and coaches under the bus." opinion based on your own argument that the "so called experts" opinions don't matter because they weren't Div 1 Coaches.

many on here have led "teams" with more people in the organization than the UC BBall program. I think comments on leadership are fair game, and that there are certainly a number of people that have more leadership experience than the coach they are evaluating.

In addition... ONE loss can break a season... although I don't think the Belmont one will. I'm alittle more nervous that they followed that loss with a last second basket win against an even lessor team than Belmont. After already seeing what they can do when they have a Let down...

[Irishbearcat]

Like my Irish, I give UC another two-three years before they really are world-beaters. The talent will be there, and also the ever-important experienced upperclassmen.

[STKohls]

We seem to have a lot of "so-called" experts who know how long this will take. Answer me this, how many of you have actually coached or played at the D-1 level? I am guessing ZERO! One loss does not a season break. Just ask Kentucky who got drilled by Gardner Webb at home. The season is a marathon and not a sprint. Now is not the time to throw the team and the coaches under the bus. Yes...the loss was ugly but Belmont is going to be pretty good this season (I believe they were picked 1st in their league).

I agree 100% with your assertion that we should give UC more than a game or two to show their abilities. Most of the issues from the Belmont game appear to be driven from a shortage of experience, not talent or coaching.

However, I disagree 100% with your derision of everyone on the forum who isn't an ex Div-I player or coach. The overwhelming majority of us are not ex players or coaches, and our arguments should stand on their own merits, not on some vetting of our resumes.

[Bearcat Fan Since 1958]

haha if this is right then he proved u wrong and prove your arguement wrong.. this is not the same situation as them.. well sorta but not exactly.. they were a little more talented to start

They were 7-21 the year before he arrived, not his first year.

Perhaps he's confused TAMU and UTEP. The Miners were 6-24 in BCG's first year.

[cincycpaw]

Cronin needs time. The program was stripped bare. Last year was a stopgap. This year's class of recruits will go a long way in determining the future of the program. Next year, we will be even younger. That's not a good thing. The following year, Mick should (and better) begin to win.

[Bearcat Fan Since 1958]

Cronin needs time. The program was stripped bare. Last year was a stopgap. This year's class of recruits will go a long way in determining the future of the program. Next year, we will be even younger. That's not a good thing. The following year, Mick should (and better) begin to win.

True. True. True. True. True. Maybe, maybe not. Very true.

The team last year was competitive. The team this year isn't (so far).

[cincycpaw]

True. True. True. True. True. Maybe, maybe not. Very true.

The team last year was competitive. The team this year isn't (so far).

Yep, and that worries me. I'm trying to have faith. Though last year's team didn't really show much improvement throughout the year, I hope this year is different.

I can't help but think that when they are juniors (Mitchell, Bishop, Davis, and Biggie) with Vaughn as a senior and Mike Williams, and then Gates, Wright, Wilks, etc...they should be winning. If they don't, we'll need a different leader.

[ralph1950]

Actually this years team has been very competitive, all three games went down to the wire against much more experienced teams.

[jkwuc89]

I just tidied up this thread a bit. Huggins posts went to a "catch-all" thread on the "Where are they now" forum. Political posts which were off-topic were deleted.