APR Data released

[GoBearcats31]

INDIANAPOLIS (AP) -- Poor academic scores could create a very different kind of madness in March.

A record 10 men's basketball teams, including three-time national champion Connecticut, will be banned from next season's NCAA tournament because of sub-par work in the classroom. UConn becomes the first BCS school to face a postseason ban in either of the two most prominent college sports based solely on the annual Academic Progress Rate scores, which were released Wednesday by the NCAA.

Each of the schools fell below the mandated cutline of 900 on their four-year scores. The APR measures the classroom performance of every Division I team. This year's data calculates rates from 2007-08 through 2010-11.

Joining the Huskies on the sideline next March will be Arkansas-Pine Bluff, California-Riverside, Cal State Bakersfield, Jacksonville State, Mississippi Valley State, North Carolina-Wilmington, Texas A&M-Corpus Christi, Toledo and Towson.


UC basketball stands at 956 (includes last four years through 2010-11), but that's a drop from a four-year score of 992 last year.

The 2010-11 Bearcats scored an 833.

I know there are other factors, but how many of the seniors the last two seasons have actually earned degrees? (And I don't know if we really want the answer to that)

[CroninCrazy]

Link:

http://espn.go.com/mens-college-bask...postseason-apr

[CincyEngGrad02]

Does anybody know where UC finished compared to the other 326 NCAA D1 schools? i know it has to be really high bc of coach Cronins focus on graduating players.

[Ruckle St.]

Originally Posted by CincyEngGrad02

Does anybody know where UC finished compared to the other 326 NCAA D1 schools? i know it has to be really high bc of coach Cronins focus on graduating players.

They are 11th in the big east. They were 3rd in the big east last year. That 833 from this season really hurts.

http://web1.ncaa.org/maps/aprRelease.jsp

[GoBearcats31]

Originally Posted by Ruckle St.

They are 11th in the big east. They were 3rd in the big east last year. That 833 from this season really hurts.

http://web1.ncaa.org/maps/aprRelease.jsp

Yeah, if they don't do well in this academic year, combined with last year's 833, that could be bad news.

I remember last year there was a news release last spring about graduating student-athletes and it didn't look good for men's basketball (I can't recall if any of the 5 or so seniors was then set to earn a degree). I mentioned my concerns about that here on the forum and at least a couple people on this board were quick to dismiss my concerns. I didn't see Yancy or Dion's names last week either. I'm all for making the Tournament and have a great season, but clearly we have to be graduating guys too. I mean, when you're at a school for four years, including summers (and with tutors) ...

[OCASCM07]

Originally Posted by GoBearcats31

Yeah, if they don't do well in this academic year, combined with last year's 833, that could be bad news.

I remember last year there was a news release last spring about graduating student-athletes and it didn't look good for men's basketball (I can't recall if any of the 5 or so seniors was then set to earn a degree). I mentioned my concerns about that here on the forum and at least a couple people on this board were quick to dismiss my concerns. I didn't see Yancy or Dion's names last week either. I'm all for making the Tournament and have a great season, but clearly we have to be graduating guys too. I mean, when you're at a school for four years, including summers (and with tutors) ...

It doesn't include this years seniors until next year. Just our seniors from last season (2010-2011) which we had an extraordinarily large amount of them for one season.

If memory serves me correct Yancy said in March he would be graduating at the end of the spring quarter. Dixon I have no clue on to be 100% positive about his stats but bleacherreport and ESPN both said he graduated.

From my time at UC I will say that between your school workload and actual work workload (which basketball is a work workload for them) it is hard to take all of your classes that you are supposed to take for your curriculum on time, and if you miss one of those classes then odds are you have to wait at least another year to take that course again which could have effected some of our seniors from last season.

When you consider that football players only miss the majority of the fall quarter of school for their games and basketball players pretty much have to go to school and play basketball competitively during the fall, winter, and beginning of the spring quarters for their games I can see why sometimes basketball players don't graduate within the four years that the NCAA expects and that isn't even taking into account off-season workouts and practices. And if you take a five year program at UC I think that also negatively effects the APR which is BS IMHO.

[GoBearcats31]

Originally Posted by OCASCM07

It doesn't include this years seniors until next year. Just our seniors from last season (2010-2011) which we had an extraordinarily large amount of them for one season.

If memory serves me correct Yancy said in March he would be graduating at the end of the spring quarter. Dixon I have no clue on to be 100% positive about his stats but bleacherreport and ESPN both said he graduated.

From my time at UC I will say that between your school workload and actual work workload (which basketball is a work workload for them) it is hard to take all of your classes that you are supposed to take for your curriculum on time, and if you miss one of those classes then odds are you have to wait at least another year to take that course again which could have effected some of our seniors from last season.

When you consider that football players only miss the majority of the fall quarter of school for their games and basketball players pretty much have to go to school and play basketball competitively during the fall, winter, and beginning of the spring quarters for their games I can see why sometimes basketball players don't graduate within the four years that the NCAA expects and that isn't even taking into account off-season workouts and practices. And if you take a five year program at UC I think that also negatively effects the APR which is BS IMHO.

I know it doesn't include this year's seniors -- that was my point in saying, they can't afford to get a low score this year (a hypothetical/speculation) added onto 833 from this year...

Second, are UC basketball players in 5 year programs? I didn't go to UC for undergrad and am not familiar with all the programs, but I doubt that the guys majoring in criminal justice are co-oping.

Yes, sometimes you have to drop a class and that can set you back, and certainly being a basketball player is a full-time job in itself. And it’s not always easy to graduate in four years, sure. But sometimes people have to be held accountable. I mean, I defended Huggins in the 90s. But now there are serious sanctions (see UConn). When I heard Kevin Johnson and Troy Caupain talk about UC’s academic programs factoring into their decisions, I am giving them the benefit of the doubt that academics do matter to them and they aren’t just saying something for an article.

What I do know is that I attended Indiana, where two junior’s on this year’s team earned their degrees, while one senior is halfway through a grad school program and another earned his master's in four years. When Tom Crean took over, he inherited a team from Kelvin Sampson that had 19 F’s among its players (surely Jordan Crawford had at least one or two). Sampson’s team that year still posted an 866 (which is 33 points higher than what the 2010-11 UC team posted).

I want the best for UC, that’s why I am concerned, that’s all.

[OCASCM07]

Originally Posted by GoBearcats31

I know it doesn't include this year's seniors -- that was my point in saying, they can't afford to get a low score this year (a hypothetical/speculation) added onto 833 from this year...

Second, are UC basketball players in 5 year programs? I didn't go to UC for undergrad and am not familiar with all the programs, but I doubt that the guys majoring in criminal justice are co-oping.

Yes, sometimes you have to drop a class and that can set you back, and certainly being a basketball player is a full-time job in itself. And it’s not always easy to graduate in four years, sure. But sometimes people have to be held accountable. I mean, I defended Huggins in the 90s. But now there are serious sanctions (see UConn). When I heard Kevin Johnson and Troy Caupain talk about UC’s academic programs factoring into their decisions, I am giving them the benefit of the doubt that academics do matter to them and they aren’t just saying something for an article.

What I do know is that I attended Indiana, where two junior’s on this year’s team earned their degrees, while one senior is halfway through a grad school program and another earned his master's in four years. When Tom Crean took over, he inherited a team from Kelvin Sampson that had 19 F’s among its players (surely Jordan Crawford had at least one or two). Sampson’s team that year still posted an 866 (which is 33 points higher than what the 2010-11 UC team posted).

I want the best for UC, that’s why I am concerned, that’s all.

When Leonard Stokes first started at UC he was in my CM classes at OCAS. I think the workload there caused him to switch majors but he still tried to start up a construction company after his playing days in Europe were over.

Totally understand. I always felt Huggs caught a bad rap on the academics portion because of how having Jucos on your team always negatively effected our APR. My thought right now is that maybe Ibrahima Thomas' transfer had a negative effect on the APR. I really wish we could know more about what brought down our grade so dramatically but I'm sure the school and NCAA is not allowed to reveal that information.

[GoBearcats31]

My final thought because I don't want to monopolize this thread and I feel like OCASCM07 and I are on the same page ... but I feel like the quarter system hasn't helped things either.

A few years ago I discovered a long sit-down interview with Andy Katz (during Huggins' year off from coaching). Huggs spoke about how these guys would have to attend pre-draft camps and work outs in May, with the spring quarter ending in June. Lots of schools end classes in early May, but UC has not been one of them. If these guys want to pursue their dream, it can get difficult.

I don't know the precise whereabouts, but I know Yancy was training out of town at least some portion of the spring. I feel like I'm contradicting myself a bit from above, I just want the program and the individual players to both be able to succeed.

[raymo]

Everyone keeps quoting that UC received an 833 for the 2010-2011 basketball season. Below are the scores from the APR website. Where is the 833 coming from? Per this, we have been well above 900 since 2007 season.



Men's Basketball University of Cincinnati OH 2004 - 2005 872
Men's Basketball University of Cincinnati OH 2005 - 2006 838 Immediate Penalty - Scholarship Reduction = 1

Men's Basketball University of Cincinnati OH 2006 - 2007 872
Men's Basketball University of Cincinnati OH 2007 - 2008 902
Men's Basketball University of Cincinnati OH 2008 - 2009 945
Men's Basketball University of Cincinnati OH 2009 - 2010 992
Men's Basketball University of Cincinnati OH 2010 - 2011 956

[raymo]

Originally Posted by raymo

Everyone keeps quoting that UC received an 833 for the 2010-2011 basketball season. Below are the scores from the APR website. Where is the 833 coming from? Per this, we have been well above 900 since 2007 season.



Men's Basketball University of Cincinnati OH 2004 - 2005 872
Men's Basketball University of Cincinnati OH 2005 - 2006 838 Immediate Penalty - Scholarship Reduction = 1

Men's Basketball University of Cincinnati OH 2006 - 2007 872
Men's Basketball University of Cincinnati OH 2007 - 2008 902
Men's Basketball University of Cincinnati OH 2008 - 2009 945
Men's Basketball University of Cincinnati OH 2009 - 2010 992
Men's Basketball University of Cincinnati OH 2010 - 2011 956

Here are the football scores, again all above 900. The 939 for this year was quoted on the Rutger rivals site, so I am not the only one getting this result. Where is 833 coming from?

[raymo]

Originally Posted by raymo

Here are the football scores, again all above 900. The 939 for this year was quoted on the Rutger rivals site, so I am not the only one getting this result. Where is 833 coming from?

opps forgot the scores.

Football University of Cincinnati OH 2004 - 2005 930
Football University of Cincinnati OH 2005 - 2006 941
Football University of Cincinnati OH 2006 - 2007 939
Football University of Cincinnati OH 2007 - 2008 947
Football University of Cincinnati OH 2008 - 2009 950
Football University of Cincinnati OH 2009 - 2010 936
Football University of Cincinnati OH 2010 - 2011 939

[GoBearcats31]

Originally Posted by raymo

Everyone keeps quoting that UC received an 833 for the 2010-2011 basketball season. Below are the scores from the APR website. Where is the 833 coming from? Per this, we have been well above 900 since 2007 season.



Men's Basketball University of Cincinnati OH 2004 - 2005 872
Men's Basketball University of Cincinnati OH 2005 - 2006 838 Immediate Penalty - Scholarship Reduction = 1

Men's Basketball University of Cincinnati OH 2006 - 2007 872
Men's Basketball University of Cincinnati OH 2007 - 2008 902
Men's Basketball University of Cincinnati OH 2008 - 2009 945
Men's Basketball University of Cincinnati OH 2009 - 2010 992
Men's Basketball University of Cincinnati OH 2010 - 2011 956

Correct, UC has a 956 overall rating for 2010-11, as it is a four-year score based on: 07-08, 08-09, 09-10, 10-11). The reason it dropped from 992 to 956 this last year is because it scored 833 individually for the 2010-11 year.
http://web1.ncaa.org/app_data/apr2011/140_2011_apr.pdf

Fortunately the scores rose every year in the prior three seasons, which is holding this rating at a fairly strong 956.

[raymo]

Originally Posted by GoBearcats31

Correct, UC has a 956 overall rating for 2010-11, as it is a four-year score based on: 07-08, 08-09, 09-10, 10-11). The reason it dropped from 992 to 956 this last year is because it scored 833 individually for the 2010-11 year.
http://web1.ncaa.org/app_data/apr2011/140_2011_apr.pdf

Fortunately the scores rose every year in the prior three seasons, which is holding this rating at a fairly strong 956.

Does someone have the individual scores for these years? I am assuming 07-08 falls off next year. We must have been kicking but somewhere along the line to get 992 overall last year.